Author Topic: bolt list  (Read 20745 times)

Hoopy_boy

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2011, 01:25:02 am »
 I know it sounds odd but I think it is how these cars are designed to break from the get go (overdriven on asphalt) and not designed for dirt. My Sprint was the same... grade 8 bolts all the way through it and no issues. Of coarse it had bigger bolts than 1/2 inch. Grade 8 bolts always bust off on my Legend on the panhard bar if I hook a rut or tap someone with the right rear. Never busted a 5 on there unless I flipped over a few times. When off-setting the front end as well as getting more suspention drop on a Legend front end, I constantly snapped 8's on the front lower rear control arm pivot points. I bent 5's since, but never sheered one off unless I endo'd or rolled one violently. 
 Another issue I had with grade 8 bolts is if I had someone helping check over my car between races. They would check if the bolts were snug by pulling on them a little each  time with a wrench.. repeated tightening this way put tention on the carbon steel and made them week. The grade 5 bolts would streatch and give a lil not becoming brittle. The only place I ran a grade 8 bolt was on the upper control arm pinch clamp. That clevis end would snap before the bolt would, no matter what bolt you stuck through that hole.
 Another aspect I looked at is if  we snapped a grade 5 (seldom), it was easier to drill and extract than a grade 8 is to drill and remove when you have to do it in the pits. Lol, honestly I don't care if racers use 8 or 5's. I prefer 5's and have had better luck with them on the Legends chassis over the years.

~ Gimpster ~


Offline racerdad

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2011, 02:18:48 am »
well this is my first legends car so after we run it for a bit i will tell you if  im grade 5 or grade 8.
thanks cody


Offline VMS Motorsports

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2011, 10:19:45 am »
When you hook your rear tire on something, say a tractor tire in the infield, wouldnt you rather have a grade 5 bolt bend/break than have the lollipop tear off the chassis and be done for the night? Wouldnt you rather have the steering arm bolts bend than break the spindle?
Just my opinion. Kind of like the oil debate, people have different opinions, run what you like
JIM BUCHER
VMS Motorsports
Worldwide Legends Parts Supplier
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http://www.vmsmotorsports.com/

Offline Schmitt20

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2011, 12:03:21 pm »
I have run grade 8 for all 5 years of my legend racing and never had a lolly pop or bolt sheer off. I have broken spindle arms and tie rods though and not the bolt so a good point about using grade 5 to break a bolt rather than a suspension piece.

Hoopy_boy

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2011, 12:15:03 pm »
 Aren't Legends Cars great ?? We can have a great oil debate AND a great bolt debate !! haha
Too bad ole Steve is missin out on this one...

~ Gimp ~


Offline IraceLegends77

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2011, 05:20:10 pm »
Jim, the key is to NOT hit the tractor tire....................LOL

I will say that I use both types and it does depend on the location as to where I use them.
Scott Wilkerson #77   Vision Graphix Racing


Offline VMS Motorsports

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #21 on: October 08, 2011, 05:40:10 pm »
Didnt hit one this year, only took the previous 3 years of hitting them to learn to avoid them  ;)
JIM BUCHER
VMS Motorsports
Worldwide Legends Parts Supplier
(262)255-7100
http://www.vmsmotorsports.com/

Offline rfd233

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2011, 01:27:35 pm »
I snapped the lolly pop in the last race of the season (not my fault of course)  and I was using grade 8's.  I'm considering putting 5's in certain places.  I still feel more comfortable using the 8's on the motor mounts and the seat. 


Hoopy_boy

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2011, 02:50:00 pm »
 Good point (motor mounts, seat and belt mounts). My suggestion on grade 5 was for suspention mounting points

~ G ~

Offline Legends57x

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #24 on: October 09, 2011, 06:01:34 pm »
I agree with Gimpster 100%....Grade 8 bolts were made for compression and high temperature apllications such as cylinder head bolts and being harder & brittle, were not made to be used in shear mode.  Grade 5 bolts are not so brittle stand up much better in applications such as suspension bolts(shear mode).  I've been using Grade 5 bolts in both my V-8 and Legends cars for over 20 years and never had a problem.  ;D
Mark Ritger
INEX Legends #1x


Offline racerdad

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #25 on: October 09, 2011, 08:20:11 pm »
so i went to 600s eb page and clicked on every bolt and made a bolt list. thought i would post it just in case so one would wont it.
-1/4-20x1.00               3/8-16x1.00
-1/4-20x1.50                 3/8-16x1.50
-1/4-20x1.75                 3/8-16x2.00
-1/4-20x2.00                 
-1/4-20x2.75

-5/16-18x0.75                  1/2-13x1.50
-5/16-18x1.00                    1/2-13x1.75
-5/16-18x1.25                      1/2-13x2.50
-5/16-18x1.50                      1/2-13x2.75
-5/16-18x2.00

Hoopy_boy

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #26 on: October 09, 2011, 09:13:14 pm »
I agree with Gimpster 100%....Grade 8 bolts were made for compression and high temperature apllications such as cylinder head bolts and being harder & brittle, were not made to be used in shear mode.  Grade 5 bolts are not so brittle stand up much better in applications such as suspension bolts(shear mode).  I've been using Grade 5 bolts in both my V-8 and Legends cars for over 20 years and never had a problem.  ;D

 Yeah, during the 80's and through the 90's, alongside racing oval we ran 4 to 8 Chevy Impalas per year in demolation derbies. We couldn't weld any seam of the bodies so chains were a must. 4 to 6 chains per door (around the door bottoms and around the frame on the passenger side in case the center pillar seperated from the lower body) .. Any grade 8 bolt holding chains together would smap off so we ran grade 5 for their bendability and streatch. Haha call that my early bolt research. Extensive training I have gone through with Honda over the years ( I am one of the top Honda bike Certified techs in the nation) we had to torque, note, and twist off different grades of bolts and thread pitches etc.. and note results of  them for exams so lets say I had prior knowledge of what bolts to run when we got into Legends cars.... lets just say I had an idea what bolts my suspention would get on my Legends Car after this past and racing sprints too
 I really can't submit my bolt list other than spare caliper bolts, valve cover bolts or wheel studs because I never riveted my fenders on, I use 1/4 inch bolts, lock nuts and washers in case we need to replace a fender at the track. Don't have to mess with rivets that way. Also all my suspention bolts are way longer as I run backer nylock nuts where ever I can. Been racing dirt too long and know better tha to rely on lock washer under a bolt head to assure all bolts will stay put on a rough dirt track..... I still chuckle at the old fuel cell mount redi rod bolts haha, grade 3 bolts holding a fuel cell in... but hey, they held without sheering off in a few awsome flips and endos our chassis went through. I wondered how much those hold down bolts streatched in a few of them wrecks...lol

~ Gimpster ~
 

Offline racerdad

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #27 on: October 09, 2011, 11:14:24 pm »
so gimpster did the legends cars come with nuts and lock washers insted of  nylocks from 600. our car had all nylocks on every thing. because if theydid i will some longer bolts than what 600s web page said.
thanks cody

Hoopy_boy

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #28 on: October 09, 2011, 11:27:14 pm »
 Yeah, car came with suspention bolts  only. Only way to confirm the factory bolts will stay in without using longer bolts and nylock nuts would be to safety wire your bolts. Big drawback in safety wiring bolts is that you have to take the time to cross drill the bolt heads and then again cross drill the threads past where they twist through the loli pop. To me that is wasted time on a Legend if you sheer off the bolt during racing. Nylocks are the way to go with longer bolts to make sure no bolts are going to fall out out on the track
 

~ Gimp ~

Hoopy_boy

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Re: bolt list
« Reply #29 on: October 10, 2011, 04:22:34 pm »
 I see where Yeatts posted on Facebook where he busted a grade 8 bolt on the lower rear control arm on a parade lap ending his night early. Evidently he got ahold of a bad batch of grade 8 bolts.
 I still stand behind my belief that grade 8 bolts sheer cuz they be brittle and a grade 5 will streatch and bend, before snapping off

~ G ~

 

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